Random Insanity Alliance Forum, Mark V
Cactuar Zone => Random lnsanity => Topic started by: Damen on April 24, 2007, 08:46:29 pm
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(Before it starts, I'm awesome and am not contemplating suicide)
My thoughts:
Ending your own life is the ultimate blasphemy. It's like looking Jesus Christ in the eye , spitting in his face, and saying "fark You"
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only if I'm really really depressed. other than that, hell no
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Agreed. Jesus is right there, with his hand out, wanting to give them the best life in the world, and they spit in his face, and kill themselves. =/
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no
never
if you want to die (any one)
just call me
so i can tell you to fark off
and eat some ice cream
and feal better
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I''ve been really farked up and depressed before, but my sheer faith in God kept me from even thinking of suicide.
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suicide, for one thing, is pointless. You're depressed, sure, but killing yourself is unlikely to make things much better. Suicide is like saying, "I quit." And I loath quitters. Ergo, suicidal people are quitters. Ergo, I hate suicidal people.
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to me its got nothing to do with god or jesus or anything like that. its just...i cant comprehend why anybody would want to commit suicide. life can get bad, but why would you want to end it. like cease existing? like you are over. especially aggravating are these like teen suicides by kids who have the most unbelievably good lives but get caught up in self-pity and for some reason decide the world would be better off without them...every single life is a miracle. there should never be any reason to kill yourself. unless maybe someone gave you a potion that started eating you from your insides out the second it entered your system. then mayybe....
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my opinion in suicide? do it.
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Suicides gay,ppl dont think about the effect of their actions on other pplz lives b4 they do it,they're just idiots who want it to end bc they're idiots,but they dont think that they're wasting the life that their parents gave them and also all the sacrifices their parents have made to make sure they made something of themselves(also the god thing).In other words suicidal ppl are selfish,and as a socialist,i hate greed.
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My god estaban... Speech normally.
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SUICIDE!
(http://www.theculture.net/barbie/dynamicbarbie2.jpg)
terrorists win
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I'm suicidal. However, the primary reason for that isn't to be selfish, as you guys say, but rather more due to the fact that my life is almost unlivable. Ask any other schizophrenic and I'm sure they'd wholeheartedly agree with me. You guys have no idea how it is to live like this, unable to distinguish fantasy and reality. It really does suck.
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I'm suicidal. However, the primary reason for that isn't to be selfish, as you guys say, but rather more due to the fact that my life is almost unlivable. Ask any other schizophrenic and I'm sure they'd wholeheartedly agree with me. You guys have no idea how it is to live like this, unable to distinguish fantasy and reality. It really does suck.
Sorta like T3H INT3RN3TS?
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Yes i do speech a lot,as for u EL,I know it probably sucks worse than i can imagine but u gotta hang in there,y ?bc u just do thats y
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suicide... one of the most selfish things you can do. you are hurting the people around you more than yourself. have you ever seen the family of a person who commits suicide? it is the most painful thing to see as they are on their knees crying and shaking their head asking "was there anything i could have done?" if life is truly depressing, you need to find some way out of it. and just so everyone knows, i know what i'm talking about. unfortunately i had a rough past which led me to 2 years of suicidal thoughts and deep depression. i was living through a pointless exsistence, where hope was no where in my heart. i finally started to recover my life when i picked up my bible and read a verse. i remember crying for hours and realizing that "this is not the way i want to live my life. if i want to change my life i have to change how i live." and so i did. and for the past 2 years i've had the happiest time of my life.
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Hell, I'd already be dead if my knife was sharper (I totally flipped out and made over 100 cuts...yes I counted...on my arm, and if the knife had been sharper, it probably would have bled out enough to do some serious crap to me), or if I had a gun.
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the me of 4 years ago, isn't someone who i'm proud of, but i am willing to share my past in order to help any others who were in my situation. so if anyone has questions or needs advice, feel free to aks me; i'll be glad to help in any way i can.
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Hell, I'd already be dead if my knife was sharper (I totally flipped out and made over 100 cuts...yes I counted...on my arm, and if the knife had been sharper, it probably would have bled out enough to do some serious crap to me), or if I had a gun.
what made you flip out?
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Suicide is the easy way out to a not so rewarding finish. No matter how hard you live you life, its not unlivable until you die. The harder it is, that much tougher you come out of it and the better for it.
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Hell, I'd already be dead if my knife was sharper (I totally flipped out and made over 100 cuts...yes I counted...on my arm, and if the knife had been sharper, it probably would have bled out enough to do some serious crap to me), or if I had a gun.
what made you flip out?
edit
And last I remember, the count was somewhere around 132 in just four hours. On my left inside forearm.
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Hell, I'd already be dead if my knife was sharper (I totally flipped out and made over 100 cuts...yes I counted...on my arm, and if the knife had been sharper, it probably would have bled out enough to do some serious crap to me), or if I had a gun.
what made you flip out?
Aside from the fact that I've always wanted to die, and believe that life is completely pointless, I found out the woman I loved was...you get the point.
inb4"That is not a good reason. blah blah blah"
Well, it is when you couple it with constant suicidal thoughts, and blahblahblahblaksdfjaslf.
And last I remember, the count was somewhere around 132 in just four hours. On my left inside forearm.
oh... i won't deny that love is painful, because it is. i know i don't have the right to ask this, but i will, did she know that you loved her?
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If she didn't know, then she sure as hell was deaf.
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thats actually brutal dude. i find it hard to even imagine how bad your life must be to do that to yourself. however, i'm going to need to learn how, because i plan on being either a psychologist or high school counsellor, so i try to help the best i can in these situations. my girlfriend when i met her was bulemic and cut her arms when i met her...when i saw the scars i actually almost cried...this cute, tonicular girl hated herself so much that she cut herself...thankfully now she hasn't cut herself since she met me, and we just went to the first meeting for eating disorders yesterday.
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In other news, it's good to see you again. (For some reason, I haven't seen you since like two weeks before the forum move. >_> Maybe I just wasn't looking hard enough.)
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yeah i erally havent posted as much as i used to...im increasing my activity though. i've posted a lot in the have you done it topic....>_>
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Man. Anyone who even contemplates suicide for any reason is stupid beyond belief. I don't think people comprehend the fact that there IS NO EXISTENCE BEYOND LIFE. I think religion has a part in suicide, because some people think that there is an afterlife. But why risk the only thing you could ever without a doubt be sure of (Your own life) on something like the religious belief that there is an afterlife? Religion is made up based on some weird crap.
And whatever pain you're going through, whatever heartbreak or trauma or physical turmoil you're going through, the only thing it all shows is that you're living. Hurt only shows that you have a life, and that you're in it, right now. People invented happy and sad. People invented emotion. It all boils down to the fact that you're in this world. So by removing yourself from this world...that's just the end. That's the end.
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and isnt there some thing in religion where if you kill yourself you sinned so youre going to hell anyways?? im not sure i know nothing about religion but i remmember that from like kingdom of heaven
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I don't think people comprehend the fact that there IS NO EXISTENCE BEYOND LIFE. I think religion has a part in suicide, because some people think that there is an afterlife.
...that's the reason I want to die. I don't want to exist any more than I already have. And I'm anti-religious, and don't believe in any afterlife.
I'm just too much of a pussy to actually finish it.
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If you are still here, then you should continue to live. If you don't die from something outside your control, then God still has need of you somewhere else. Suicide is foolish. You may not see it this, way, but people still need you. It doesn't matter the circumstance, regardless of what you have, what problems you have, there is nothing bigger than God. Trust in him, and life will go fun. I would know. I'm brink suicidal, life sucks and stuff, but still, I've got Jesus. All I need there.
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If you are still here, then you should continue to live. If you don't die from something outside your control, then God still has need of you somewhere else. Suicide is foolish. You may not see it this, way, but people still need you. It doesn't matter the circumstance, regardless of what you have, what problems you have, there is nothing bigger than God. Trust in him, and life will go fun. I would know. I'm brink suicidal, life sucks and stuff, but still, I've got Jesus. All I need there.
I'm anti-religious
Just in case your message was pointed towards me.
If it wasn't, then disregard this, except you must realize that not everyone believes silly religions.
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"silly religions"? I'm not talking about a religion. I'm talking about a relationship.
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Even if life sucks, it's the only thing that you're ever going to have. Ever.
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well, except for eternity, Flask. Life with or without God.
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i won't deny that suicide always seems stupid to outsiders, but even now, looking backi can't believe i was once thought and acted that way. i've realized how much i love my life and most importantly, the people in it. i've come along way in the past 4 years, and the path to get to this "better" me wasn't an easy one. there were too many days of endless tears and crying myself to sleep... but i got through it all with the help of my sister and my God. sometimes you need to tell someone about your problems, so they can help you. i did, and it was the first step out of that life of pathetic exsistence and into a life with meaning and purpose.
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I've thought about suicide many ties in the past(im not gonna go into detail why i was gonna commit suicide). But i decided not to go through with it and see what life still have to offer. So far its been good actually, I've met my dream girl and i've made a good friend that i can trust. The way i would've gone was by jumping into a car, poisoning myself, running through a busy highway system, having the police shoot me and etc. But i was very young when i was thinking of suicide and i had lost faith in god when i was thinking like that. To this day i dont believe in god and i've been better than i ever was. Im kinda going through some hard times now. But i'll get through it by myself and maybe with the help of my friends.(thats if i let them help)
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i'm glad you've chosen to continue life. =)
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Suicide is (most often) a permanent solution to a very temporary problem.
in my experience anyway.
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I've never really contemplated suicide. My outlook as always been "I'm gonna die someday anyway. If I die now, I might miss something interesting, like an alien invasion or the Red Sox winning the World Series." See, that's one of two down!
P.S. bioakky, did you ever post a video of you cutting "RI" into your arm?
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I wouldn't do it.
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P.S. bioakky, did you ever post a video of you cutting "RI" into your arm?
Yep, that was me.
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hey! i saw that!
also, quit shoving religion and jesus talk up our asses.
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hey, it's my calling.
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Religion is good and stupid, Jesus was a crazy illusionist and God is something not real but yet people have faith to give them meaning and hope.
*raises his flame shield*
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Jesus was a crazy illusionist? How do you fool all the senses as he did? i.e. make them think they were drinking wine instead of water? How could he have deceived people into thinking Lazarus was dead from miles away? There's no way Jesus could have used illusions there, particularly when he was hung up on the cross- they stuck a spear in his side and the water was separated from the blood as it came out his side.
But enough, this is not the place to be talking of such stuff. If you want to talk about religion, do it where it's meant to be. Get this back on topic.
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But where's the proof that what they were drinking was wine?
Where's the profasdlfkjasdflkj?
That's right. You don't have any. Kthxbai.
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there is as much proof for a God as there is against a God. So there's a very fine line for debate here. It's just whichever evidence is more convincing. Okay, let's put it this way. We assume Jesus existed, that he did all these things, and we know he was executed. How, then, do we explain the actions of the apostles? Surely they would not do what they did because Jesus was an illusionist. They were mayrtered, every last one, save John who was exiled. Why would they do it for some crazy illusionist? Because they believed that he had risen.
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There is no proof of god man. All you have is faith, faith in believing that there's a god. Faith that gives you hope and meaning. You can't prove there is no god if you can't prove that he/she is even there. Just about everything in this world can be explained.
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Did the fear of going to hell change your mind on suicide?
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If she didn't know, then she sure as hell was deaf.
You're sense of humor makes me giggle until I pee.
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there is as much proof for a God as there is against a God. So there's a very fine line for debate here. It's just whichever evidence is more convincing. Okay, let's put it this way. We assume Jesus existed, that he did all these things, and we know he was executed. How, then, do we explain the actions of the apostles? Surely they would not do what they did because Jesus was an illusionist. They were mayrtered, every last one, save John who was exiled. Why would they do it for some crazy illusionist? Because they believed that he had risen.
... How do we know they were martyred?
And Judas was not a martyr, he was betrayed by God when he betrayed Jesus.
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The bible isn't accurate ya know. The stories in the bible were written several decades, maybe centuries. So the text will not be accurate. The bible is more like an exaggerated history book, written by people who were insane or written to benefit a religion =/
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If she didn't know, then she sure as hell was deaf.
You're sense of humor makes me giggle until I pee.
My sarcasm detectors are broken today.
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If she didn't know, then she sure as hell was deaf.
You're sense of humor makes me giggle until I pee.
My sarcasm detectors are broken today.
I thought it was funny, no joke.
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I'm not going to be bothered to debate this here. Let's put this topic back on track, and debate this where it's meant to be debated. If you really want to discuss this, do it in the religion topic.
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Gotcha, Shy. >_>
The until I pee part threw me off.
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If you want proof, read the Bible. If you want proof of God, of creation, of his miracles, read the Bible. If you don't like the bible or think its false, then don't worry about anything, and just try and focus on what makes that real. If you don't want to, shut it. Don't say there's no proof when there's a 1000+ paged book at the nearest church or Christian home. If you don't know/haven't read the Bible, and don't know if its true or not, be silent about proving God real or not, because you don't know the proof we have to begin with. I'll start.
Jesus was real. Why? Look at history. He was crucified, and he was put to death. He was a real person (Almost all religions aknowledge him in one way or another. Yet not all of them aknowledge, say, Buddha. Why's that? He was real.). So, we know Jesus of Nazareth was real, cool. He performed many miracles in the Bible. How do we know they are true? Almost all miracles that I know if spoken in the Bible from Jesus or not have physical proof. Sodom and Gommorah was found to the point where you can travel there, and dig out the brimstone that rained down and obliterated the city by God. Fish fossils on the tops of the highest mountains. Chariots in the Red sea. Earthquake happened on the day of crucifiction. And Jericho was found. So, all of that is true, and really did happened. So why would they lie about Jesus? Jesus is the truth.
And from here on, continue discussion in the religion topic save we go, gasp, off topic.
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You're too naive, and we can't just attribute coincidences and bad things happening as miracles. Do you realize that NOT ONE of those acts is a GOOD miracle? They all deal with death and destruction. That's not the kind of God I want to put faith in, when he just treats us like his playthings, giving us free will for nothing. I don't want to be some tool of his that he uses, when in the end everything is purposeless and amounts to nothing. The reason for our 'creation' was only to boost his own ego, or because he was bored. As far as I have seen, God is no wiser than the rest of us, and is arrogant and the completely unhumble.
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Well, God wasn't being destructive to the Christians, or Jews, was he? He was only destroying the enemies that would have their heads, so they could be free. The whole time those guys were there, and the people who had to be killed never went to them. And if God was so deadly, why are you still standing? Why is anyone breathing? Because that would sort of kick his son, Jesus, in the face. After he y'know, died for our sins, and rose again, and promises salvation. He loves us Shy, more then anything. I /promise/ you, a promise that won't be broken, that if you follow Jesus in your life, your life will be so much better. If you study his Word, and follow it, it will be so much better. All miracles listed were Old Testament, I believe. Things weren't fun then, I gather. And as for the flood, not one person on the earth was good, save Noah. They were an ancient New york, but with 100x more sin, and the entire earth was it. He got rid of them all, but cried after, and promised to never do a flood again. An all hating, all deadly God wouldn't cry from his actions, would he? It shows me that he loves us. And he doesn't need to do that again, since Jesus came, and took our sins to the cross. Same thing for Sodom and gommorah. God said, "Yea, if but 1 good man could be found, it would be saved." There was not one. Going on, Jesus died for us, as said. He knew all along that he was going to be put to death, and he went anyway. He allowd himself to be killed (Horribly.), what all powerful all hating God would send his son to the cross for our sins, so that we may be saved? And you might list off some bad times, some trials. In the words of TD Jakes, "If it is not used to lift you up, and grow you, it is not of God! It is not of God!". If the trials you face are not to make you a wiser, or stronger person, do not blame God. God tests us as people to be the best we can be, to speak the truth, to be kind, and to love. Not to kill, slaughter, and hate. If the entire world turns against you, guess who's still there that matters? Jesus Christ.
The Holy Spirit is not evil, or destructive.
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Then why has m life begun to get better since my faith in traditional christianity has waned?
I will never give up believing entirely, in Jesus or God, but I can't carry on a charade that so many other Christians do.
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I never said life is all hell without God. God is blessing you Shy. He's not going to cast you to the dogs if you don't believe.
Charade?
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I never said life is all hell without God. God is blessing you Shy. He's not going to cast you to the dogs if you don't believe.
So then, what do you call going to hell because you don't believe in god?
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I will admit, some, if not many, "Christians" carry on quite the charade. Some I would recommend for a career in acting.
Also, I think that you do not want to put your faith in the Lord because you don't understand why he would cause so much death. He would rather not, for he is a God of love. And yet, many choose to overlook the fact that he is also a God of Justice, and he must punish those who do evil. That is why the endtimes will be so bad, because his wrath will be turned on full force. This is nothing.
And just because you leave Christianity doesn't mean your life will go downhill. In fact, it probably would be opposite. Jesus guarantees that those who follow him will suffer, for we follow him and the world hated him first.
Why would God create us? No one can quite know. It's not worth debating, just be thankful he did. It's another one of those things about him that we cannot wrap our tiny minds around. We just don't understand it. Personally, I don't want to understand it. Why? Because that would mean that his intellectual capacity is at our level.
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I never said life is all hell without God. God is blessing you Shy. He's not going to cast you to the dogs if you don't believe.
So then, what do you call going to hell because you don't believe in god?
Someone once explained it to me like this: "If an unholy man stood in the presence of God without the power of Jesus to protect him from God's holy power, and if the lake of fire was a hundred yards away, the man would run as fast as he possibly could and fling himself into the lake."
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Are you telling me that an athiest will go to hell on his own free will?
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that would be a fine wake up call, being sent to a place you don't believe in...
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Are you telling me that an athiest will go to hell on his own free will?
EVERYONE goes to hell on their own free will. The Bible says that God's creation declares his very existence. If you don't believe in him, it's not for the lack of his trying.
And yes, that would be quite the wake-up call.
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I think you missed the fact that one cannot go to place which does not exist. (Unless by some force of science [note: NOT religion] that we do not yet understand.)
You also missed Ravaged's sarcasm.
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I never said life is all hell without God. God is blessing you Shy. He's not going to cast you to the dogs if you don't believe.
So then, what do you call going to hell because you don't believe in god?
I call that not believing in God? That person going to Hell chose not to live with God all their life. Thats what that is to me.
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But even if someone would (obvously) prefer to go to heaven then hell, if they don't believe in it, they still go to hell.
It's not an option. People don't make themselves believe something that they don't believe.
It doesn't matter how much you would like to go to heaven, if you can't get yourself to believe in it, then you can't go.
That's got to be one of the most self-centered things that I've ever heard.
'If you don't beleive in me and accept my son as your savior, you're fucked. I don't care how good of a person you are or what you do in your life. However, if you murder 50 people in a airport, then accept my son as your savior while you're in prison, you're welcome to come to heaven with me.'
Fuck that.
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...wow when did this topic go into a religious debate?
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Honestly, Azural, you have a completely warped view of salvation. Salvation is for anyone. Jesus died for us, for /all/ our sins. If a man kills 10000 people, pillages 100 villages, and kills his family, then bows his knee to Christ, and accepts him, he is saved. Sin, and redemption. It shows how incredible God is, that he will forgive you, and love you no matter what. His love is unconditional. But if you are too caught up in facts or science or literal proof all your life, and never try to live for him in the first place, you will go to hell. Since you never really cared to find God anyway, see? Thats not his fault, or a problem or a wrong doing for God, its the person's choice. If you're the best person in the world, give money left and right, make peoples lives great, you're not worrying about salvation. You can't be good enough to go to God, except through his son. The fact would most likely be right in front of the guy's face, and he never followed Jesus or applied his love to his already good life.
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Let's assume for a moment that God and heaven does exist...but only for a moment.
So if I go and bring the world to perfect utopia (without bringing to fruition my dreams/plans of destroying all religion), and kill no one or commit no "sins," and then die one year later (still "sin"less), I would not deserve to go to heaven?
ox. Shit.
Of course, that would be assuming God or heaven existed...and that assumption is officially over.
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You can't not sin, Bio. So really, that doesn't help. If you sin once, we are hopeless. But through Christ, we are saved. What on /earth/ is so hard about that? Have you tried God, have you ever shut up your head about pure facts or second thoughts, and just tried to walk with Jesus? Tried to get to know him?
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You can't not sin, Bio. So really, that doesn't help. If you sin once, we are hopeless. But through Christ, we are saved. What on /earth/ is so hard about that? Have you tried God, have you ever shut up your head about pure facts or second thoughts, and just tried to walk with Jesus? Tried to get to know him?
Shut my head, as in attempted to remain ignorant of all rational thoughts and ideas, then no, never tried and never going to.
Honestly, Azural, you have a completely warped view of salvation. Salvation is for anyone. Jesus died for us, for /all/ our sins. If a man kills 10000 people, pillages 100 villages, and kills his family, then bows his knee to Christ, and accepts him, he is saved. Sin, and redemption. It shows how incredible God is, that he will forgive you, and love you no matter what. His love is unconditional. But if you are too caught up in facts or science or literal proof all your life, and never try to live for him in the first place, you will go to hell. Since you never really cared to find God anyway, see? Thats not his fault, or a problem or a wrong doing for God, its the person's choice. If you're the best person in the world, give money left and right, make peoples lives great, you're not worrying about salvation. You can't be good enough to go to God, except through his son. The fact would most likely be right in front of the guy's face, and he never followed Jesus or applied his love to his already good life.
... You just reiterated EXACTLY what he was talking about.
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Bible THUMP
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I can't walk with and/or get to know a non-existent idea.
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yea I just like waching them yell at each other:)
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you know, I pity all of you who do not believe. I really do. And that's hard for me, because I am a rather sadistic personality. One of my many flaws. But I pity! You who do not believe in God have no hope. After you die, there is nothing but darkness. Eternal darkness. And then, the world will be destroyed and all of your achievements will be for naught. No hope there. Personally, I'll take my hope even if there is no God, because I do not suffer if I am wrong. But if you are wrong... I shudder to think of the pain you will endure.
Azural, "For ALL (emphasis mine) have sinned an fallen short of the glory of God." That means anyone. "For any who is guilty of one is guilty of all." So essentially, you break one commandment, you are guilty of breaking them all. Theoretically, if one man never sinned, never did wrong, perfectly followed all of God's commandments, yes, he would go to Heaven, but it's impossible to not sin. Hence why we need a savior.
"For our acts of righteousness are like filthy rags to the Lord."
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invincible...why are you here preaching to us if you're agnostic? -_-
I welcome darkness; in fact, I crave it. I need the sweet release of death. But I'm a wimp, and won't go through with suicide.
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I'm not agnostic. What gave you that idea?
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Personally, I'll take my hope even if there is no God, because I do not suffer if I am wrong.
Borderline agnostic right there.
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how so? My understanding was that agnostics believe that God is out there but can't be reached. I was merely making the point that if my beliefs are incorrect and an atheist's is, then I don't take a penalty for being wrong, while the other way around (I'm right and the atheist's wrong) the atheist ends up in hell.
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Agnostic is pretty much, "I'll wait until death to find out. Until then, I'll live well."
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I'm nothing like that. I must admit that sometimes I doubt my God, but then he proves himself. I don't wait till I die to find out. I already have. I'm nowhere near agnostic. My point was simply this: the atheist being right has no effect on me even though I was wrong, but the reverse is not the same.
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I never do doubt God, but I doubt his motives or actions. Then I listen to a good song or a motivational lesson, or informing lesson about the works of God, then that feeling of mine goes away quick.
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I never do doubt God, but I doubt his motives or actions. Then I listen to a good song or a motivational lesson, or informing lesson about the works of God, then that feeling of mine goes away quick.
That's called brainwashing, and tricking yourself into something your mind knows that is silly anyways.
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not necessarily silly, just something it doesn't (and shouldn't) understand
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Wow Shy, please, step down a notch. -_- I'm not brainwashed, crap dude. I don't even feel like responding to that.
Because I sometimes loose my way, or wonder what God's going to do with me, and I use people who know or talk to people who care, I'm brainwashed? Because I need some motivation, or loose track of what God wants me to do, I'm brainwashing myself? You sound like everyone in the Christian religion is an ignorant, self absorbed damn executioner. Everyone is brainwashed this or stupid that, thats not true. Get off your high horse man, just because I motivate myself doesn't mean anyone I listen to, or anything I tell myself, is brainwashing.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
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what you may perceive as lies may be truth... but I cannot change your opinion, it seems.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
I dislike a good part of the Christian religion, so that's not really wrong.
I'm sorry wtp, but... Well, you basically are one of the people who made me become afraid enough of God to believe in the religion. Southern Baptists.
Wtp, I just don't think you can quite understand what it's like, honestly. I'm sure you've had your own trials with religion, and I'm sayingmine have been worse, just different.
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Also, I don't think that God is all-powerful, for another thing.
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made me become afraid enough of God to believe in the religion.
Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God anyone?
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
Prove they're lies, please.
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Also, I don't think that God is all-powerful, for another thing.
If he isn't, then people could go back on his plans/Change them, or just ignore him. All of which are impossible.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
I dislike a good part of the Christian religion, so that's not really wrong.
I'm sorry wtp, but... Well, you basically are one of the people who made me become afraid enough of God to believe in the religion. Southern Baptists.
Wtp, I just don't think you can quite understand what it's like, honestly. I'm sure you've had your own trials with religion, and I'm sayingmine have been worse, just different.
Unless you aren't being literal, I live on the East. My beliefs are that we should follow Jesus in our life, and try to walk with him. To uphold his ministry, and to try and be the best Christians we can. Sorry I'm scary.
Please, just because I'm Christian, don't assume I've had a cloud 9 life.
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Also, I don't think that God is all-powerful, for another thing.
If he isn't, then people could go back on his plans/Change them, or just ignore him. All of which are impossible.
...you just said you have no free will.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
Prove they're lies, please.
Just wait for your death.
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No, I didn't. I said we cannot erase God, or remove him. We cannot leave him out of the equation, he is all powerful and all knowing. We cannot ignore his plans, or not hear them. But we have the choice to accept them or not.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
Prove they're lies, please.
Just wait for your death.
When death arrives, I'll see my savior. So, yeah, that doesn't help. Prove to me that God doesn't exist, what I believe in is lies, etc.
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Also, I don't think that God is all-powerful, for another thing.
If he isn't, then people could go back on his plans/Change them, or just ignore him. All of which are impossible.
No, I didn't. I said we cannot erase God, or remove him. We cannot leave him out of the equation, he is all powerful and all knowing. We cannot ignore his plans, or not hear them. But we have the choice to accept them or not.
That is all...
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..What are you getting at? The things you bolded are pro free will. o_O
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No, the things I bolded completely destroyed the point the other was making.
One says you can't go against him. The other says you can go against him however much you like.
Maybe if religion actually made sense, and wasn't just a system to control people under rules (that I hate)...I'd be more accepting of it (but still not believing).
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It /isn't/ a system to control people. Christianity's entire foundation is free will, and choice, and following God. The things I posted are pro free will. You can ignore God, but thats free will. You can accept him or not, thats free will. Not accepting is the same as ignoring. Are the beliefs of Christianity /so/ hard to even look at without getting hostile? I mean seriously its not like I, or other Christians, want to destroy the world. Jesus' messages were on love, peace, understanding, salvation--Good Lord would you rather us follow something without purpose or a God, or be horrible people? We follow Jesus in our lives, and follow his plan. I've seen his love, and his hand in my life, enough to prove that God is real. I follow him in hopes of making Jesus proud, and to help others. Save me before I commit another sin as equal to that. You're so caught up in trying to disprove it, you have no idea what you're even saying. You would rather there not be guidelines, or a Lord we can follow? You would rather our lives be pointless? There is no way to disprove God, only ignorance to hide him in. You can say that everything disproves God, I can say everything proves him. The fact is, you haven't tried Jesus yet. You haven't brought him into your life yet, or tried to understand him.
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He's saying you're brainwashed because you're believing lies...Lies that a god exists/existed/whatever and that Jesus is whoamgallpowerfulblahblah, and all that.
Not whatever you just said.
>_> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, Shy. *fkees your wrath*
I dislike a good part of the Christian religion, so that's not really wrong.
I'm sorry wtp, but... Well, you basically are one of the people who made me become afraid enough of God to believe in the religion. Southern Baptists.
Wtp, I just don't think you can quite understand what it's like, honestly. I'm sure you've had your own trials with religion, and I'm sayingmine have been worse, just different.
Unless you aren't being literal, I live on the East. My beliefs are that we should follow Jesus in our life, and try to walk with him. To uphold his ministry, and to try and be the best Christians we can. Sorry I'm scary.
Please, just because I'm Christian, don't assume I've had a cloud 9 life.
... That's sort of what I put the "Not saying mine were worse" clause in there...
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Stupid kids...
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Who?
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Anybody who contemplates suicide. It's childish invincibility thinking. The full consequences of such actions are incomprehensible, and these fools actually want to do it.
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hey, watch out who what you say about invincibility! :-D Just kidding.
Yeah, suicide's foolish. I don't care a lick about other people's feelings (man I'm messed up... thank God for, well, himself) but I can see enough that I won't.
And Shy, watch what you type, because you actually said, "I'm sayingmine have been worse" instead of the negative, which you undoubtedly meant.
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Ohh... Yeah, that's supposed to say "haven't".
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I know I am the new kid on the block here, but I would like to throw my few cents into this topic since I have tried, failed and still wished it would have worked when I tried. *puts up the shields against flaming for that admittance*
Suicide and religion have always been tied together. Everyone has there POVs on both subjects, some have a short answer and others have the long almost novel version to give as to why they are pro-suicide or anti-suicide. Through out history a lot of the more CockPonytic scenes had suicide in it, for example "Romeo and Juliet". Star crossed lovers whom since their families couldn't resolve the differences they had blamed themselves and took their own life so they could be together. All be it, twas to be a rouse...but that is how it ended up.
I have been given the lines of "It's selfish to kill yourself, don't you know who all you'd hurt by doing that?" and the infamous "He isn't worth it.." one. But the fact remains that it is your choice to go. It is illegal to kill yourself in most countries, namely the US. That is even if you are terminally ill with Cancer or another disease that is far beyond treatment. In most cases people bare such burdens that they can't handle it anymore, medically or otherwise. So, they wish to terminate their lives so then they no longer carry it.
My version is both personal and well, more to the "left" as it were. We are not given a choice to be born, why shouldn't we have the choice to terminate our lives should we see fit? The law doesn't choose our religion for us (at least here in the US) so why should they tell us what we can do with our lives and bodies? On the personal note, my life hasn't exactly been happy...the few and rare times I have a happy moment, it has turned into a nightmare. I haven't tried to kill myself since I was 16, and I do not cut myself only due to the fact that I do not wish to have another emergency order to go to some "Happy Farm" and have pills shoved down my throat because they claim it'll make me all better.
Not only that, I do have medical problems where it is hard for me to learn on the same level as other people, and I am extremely shy or nervous in social situations so I don't communicate too well in person. In general it is a problem for me, I know what I wanna say, but getting it out verbally is a pain. Yes, I can speak and my vocabulary is pretty high, but putting into something someone understands is a big deal. So, I get flustered and well, you can take it from there.
Basically, it should be your choice and no one else's should you choose to kill yourself. And no one should tell you how you should live your life either...give advice, yes; tell you...no.
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allow me to challenge your view for a moment.
Suicide, to me, is cowardly. It says, "I haven't the guts to go on with life; it's all too hard for me so I'll just quit. I'll end it all and not take advantage of the life I've been given." It's sorta like staying behind in the Foxhole when your CO tells you to move forward. "I can't face the hardships ahead."
Happiness is a point of view, really. I suffer because I am beyond most people in terms of intellect. Thus, I draw unnecessary ire from those who don't appreciate it. But I have never contemplated suicide, never cut myself, never done any of that crap. Why? To me, it's sorta like practice. I am called to be happy in my suffering. And so I continue on.
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Yes, but if you have a severe medical problem like terminal Cancer and the pain gets so bad that it hurts to even breathe (I knew someone with small cell cancer), then you should be allowed to. Other countries allow asst. suicide only after going through extensive psychological testing as well as physical to make sure that the claim is true before they sign off on it.
States of mind can change drastically for some folks, and hardships can double with a certain state of mind. But for some the state of living can be more overwhelming then the state of mind to bare.
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nothing is too painful for you to handle. Nothing. Believe me, I've almost destroyed myself with the antics I've put myself through. In general, what I'm saying is be a man and die like one, regardless of your gender. Fight it to the end. Giving up is a waste of the time God has given you. Even if you feel like you're dying of pain, do something until you die. Don't give it up.
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"Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved." - Helen Keller
Is basically what you are saying, however giving up is the only choice a lot of people see left. Why not allow them to do so? Holding on to a ghost is not possible, and those that chose death see it that way.
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Just a quick poll: How many of you suicide contemplators have something truly debilitating in their lives?
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the thing with me is that I can't fathom why people give up at all, having done so only rarely myself. I make it a point to never give up, and that is likely why I would never again consider suicide, regardless of the pain I'm in. I'll go until I die of something outside my control, that's the only way I see fit to go.
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the thing with me is that I can't fathom why people give up at all, having done so only rarely myself. I make it a point to never give up, and that is likely why I would never again consider suicide, regardless of the pain I'm in. I'll go until I die of something outside my control, that's the only way I see fit to go.
Exactly.
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Just a quick poll: How many of you suicide contemplators have something truly debilitating in their lives?
That's not my biggest reason for wanting to die. Truth be told, there's no ENORMOUS thing in my life that makes me depressed.
I'm actually only depressed by daily life edit
The real reason for suicidalism (not a word, but still a good description) for me is that I have always felt incomplete as a person. The closer I get to pain and death, the better I feel. I can barely stand to look at my arm now that many of the scabs/scars are starting to fade because I feel...empty. I crave...even seek out death. I don't know how better to explain it...
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that's pretty morbid. I mean, me having a sadistic streak and all, I enjoy death, but not my own death. That's no fun. I have so much more to live for, and so does everyone else. If you haven't died from something beyond your control, then you still have a purpose.
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Happiness is a point of view, really. I suffer because I am beyond most people in terms of intellect. Thus, I draw unnecessary ire from those who don't appreciate it. But I have never contemplated suicide, never cut myself, never done any of that crap. Why? To me, it's sorta like practice. I am called to be happy in my suffering. And so I continue on.
... That's one of the most conceited and egotistical things I've ever heard.
Just because you're so sure of yourself, doesn't mean everyone else is.
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Happiness is a point of view, really. I suffer because I am beyond most people in terms of intellect. Thus, I draw unnecessary ire from those who don't appreciate it. But I have never contemplated suicide, never cut myself, never done any of that crap. Why? To me, it's sorta like practice. I am called to be happy in my suffering. And so I continue on.
... That's one of the most conceited and egotistical things I've ever heard.
Just because you're so sure of yourself, doesn't mean everyone else is.
/agree with Shyox
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which part is conceited, the part about being intelligent, or the other part?
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Suicide.. here's my belief on it.
Life will whoop you. Life will kick you up and down the highest mountains, and throw you into the hottest firefights. But in the immortal words of Rocky Balboa, "Its not about how hard you can hit, but how much you can get hit and keep moving forward!". Some good songs by Johnny cash are Drive on, Help me, and Redemption. All of them deal with hurt, and pain, and moving forward. He notions that life may get so though, and painful, but its never out of God's control. Things may get so rough, and painful but its never out of God's control. That gives me hope, and keeps suicide away. Life may be tough, and it may break you down, but it can never kill you. Trials, hard times, arguements, broken relationships--None of them can stop the time. Drive on, my friends. It may seem horrible, but it will get better. Break up with a life long love? Again to quote Bob marley, "Have no fear for Atomic energy, cause none of them can stop the time.". If it doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger. And a lesson by TD Jakes was, "If it isn't to lift you up, and to help you grow, it is not from God!" Funny thing is? God controls everything. ALL trials are to help you grow. They may seem, and may be, horrible, hard, and tedius, but God is there. They are there to help you grow. Suicide is cowardly, because you're backfiring this. You're spitting at Jesus Christ, and giving up. If you are a Christian and knew him, he will welcome you home. But you will see what could have been, if you drove on. Don't give up, don't kill yourself. March through the trials, and grow.
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suicide... one of the most selfish things you can do. you are hurting the people around you more than yourself. have you ever seen the family of a person who commits suicide? it is the most painful thing to see as they are on their knees crying and shaking their head asking "was there anything i could have done?" if life is truly depressing, you need to find some way out of it.
Not My Words Exactly, But
---Suicide is NOT a selfish act. You all say that they're burritos their loved ones behind and hurting them, but that really only makes you selfish. How can you expect this person to continue living through all the pain that their life is giving them? To go through the feeling of being invisible, like they have no one to confide in? To go through feeling like everybody that once loved them has now abandoned them? And to go through feeling that everyday the walls are closing in on them and that everyday they are sinking further and further into despair? Into loneliness and heartache? How on earth can you expect someone to live with that all the time, just to keep everybody else happy? It's not like it's their duty to make everyone happy. So stop being selfish yourself and think of the individual for once.
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Suicide is a last resort only, in my opinion. If your life really sucks that much and there is no possibility of changing it, then I guess if that's what you really want to do then go ahead. I once felt like that it was my only option but I stuck through it because I had friends. I'm happy I did, but I also understand that there are people who aren't that lucky.
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^i agree.
also, lol at c-zom/wethepeople/whatever, opinions change man.
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My thoughts on suicide are pretty much Adolf Von Sippycup's. I'd discourage anybody from trying it, but, if somebody's really backed up against a corner enough that they feel an escape from their pain is worth all the pain they'd cause...well...I wouldn't blame them myself, since I've been in that situation. Though, thankfully, I obviously didn't kill myself.
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well, coincidentally, i just got back from a speech by dr kevorkian... (seriously, i did - google news it, he just spoke at uf)
so here's my opinion on euthanasia-style suicide (because it's on my mind): if you are in pain from some horrible disease you have the right to die. not the right to kill yourself, but to ask your doctor to put you down. we do it to cats and dogs in order to end their lives without pain. so why is it illegal in 49 states (the exception is oregon) to do it to a human? why must we suffer through terminal illness until the bitter end?
as for suicide by depressed people... no. there are psychiatric treatments that can fix depression. if drugs and counseling don't do it, electroshock treatment will in almost every case, according to my psychology class last year. it's remarkably more humane than people imagine, and pretty much works miracles on even the most depressed people. the problem is that our mental health system is in tatters and needs to be fixed. maybe if we can finally get universal healthcare in this backwards country, then we can fix that along with the rest of the medical industry.
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I agree with the Catholic Church on this one. Life is a wonderful gift, you shouldn't destroy any life, including your own.
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someone's life is their own. being given life doesn't include signing a contract with a divine power that you will always keep the life. if I did somehow sign some contract, i dont remember, and i think not remembering is a good excuse if I should break it.
all the moral bs contrived about why it is evil has nothing to do with god, if a god exists that is worth believing in. more likely you came up with those guilts and fears and shames because you lack a positive motivation with which to confront such a profound question. now this is natural to be in this state of numbness so as not to want to think about such questions as 'do i know personally of a reason to live, such as a personal experience that makes my present pain and likely future pain worth enduring?' relevant to that question are the amounts of pain present and likely in the future. irrelevant are second hand motivations, which religion usually is. here, i know i'm going on and on, but i'll paste something.
<blahblahblah>evil can be logically equated to chaos, entropy, pain, waste, and the imbalance that causes these things. that doesn't mean there's always someone to blame. but life is a struggle against entropy, against forces that pull things toward their basest state, which is a state opposed to life. life is a self-preserving order. it inherently views anything that destroys that order to be 'bad.' the notions of eternal damnation are not necessary or practical but the ideas of 'good and bad' are.
life is also a self-advancing order, as a means of preserving that order. for this reason all life seeks to render itself absolute and objectify itself from the universe. whether there was a god before or not, life believes in attaining godhood. however if there were a god, an objectified life-form, then knowing/becoming one with that god would be an efficient way of transcending the non-life, the limitations of the world spelled out in terms of chaos, entropy, and breaking down.
this is always fun to bring up when people disrespect religions with the attitude of being non-religious and naturalistic. all life exercises faith in that it believes in living and will reach beyond sanity to preserve itself. it will deny what it perceives if this denial could serve it. life is fundamentally religious. instinct is the first religion, and it powers the subconscious of even the most devout atheist. faith and stimuli are the base elements of all thought, although there remains a distinction between faith with evidence and evidence which implies a faith (the faith then being self-evident).</blahblahblah>
this was in another forum in response to 'does evil exist' and is .. pertinent. well mainly the part about life, believing in attaining godhood. the soul wants to be a god, a perfect, ecstatic, unlimited, unthreatened being. and this is why people even Can find a motivation for killing themselves. 'attaining' is really more about evolution than religion. although a lot of religious people are also evolving. just saying, god didnt make religion, dont let it distract you.
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What kind of dumbass piece of shit really has the time to think about suicide? Get your priorities straight. I mean I'd at least burn down my house, and then destroy the world before I tried to kill myself.
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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
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The only way I'd ever do myself in was if the zombie apocalypse became a reality, and I was being swarmed with only one oxet left. I just hope the gun doesn't jam.
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i'd rather be a zombie. but i could never figure out why they didnt eat eachother.
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This topic was continued from, like, MAY of last year by BlackMario. Heheh.
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I only just noticed this topic, and thus have not read it, so this may have already been stated, but I don't care:
Every suicide means one less emo kid.
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My dad's boss killed himself. He left a wife, a daughter (I think she's 18 or 19) and a son (two years younger) behind. His wife found him dead with a gun in his hands. I don't know why he did it, but it's really shitty for his family. Of course, he maybe had his reasons, but killing yourself and burritos behind your family is not a good solution.